Fame.cool wrote:recent tv appearance excepted!
Threads being deleted
The list of current moderators can be accessed by looking at the list of options to the left of the site logo, at the top of the page. Single click the Usergroups link. From the page that is shown, you can conjure up lists of various groups on the board. Select moderators from the topmost drop down menu and there you will see the Fruit chat moderating team.
Here at Fruit chat, we strive to provide fruitational excellence and our hardworking team of moderators monitor the board with diligent probity around all hours. Feel the need to speak directly with a moderator? Simply trace your way to The Fruit Chat homepage and look at the users currently online, displayed at the very bottom of the page. Names in green are moderators.
Our moderators are trained to the highest standard of client compliance and will do everything to make your stay as welcoming and entertaining as possible, whilst maintaining professional standards in relation to publicly posted board content.
Currently personal moderator details are only transparent to all board users at the discretion of a particular moderator. These details may be present on the moderators Fruit chat profile. I choose to keep my personal details private.
In answer to some of your interests in moderator details, I shall reveal that I am not in the legal profession. I do not play quiz machines professionally, neither did I capitalise on the recent controversial 'exploits' discussed.
I was invited to be a moderator last year on the recommendation of the current moderatory team at that time. There is an 'admin' or 'big chef' who is the Alan Sugar of Fruitchat, sitting in his board room, ready and waiting to fire any unruly moderators. Fruitchat moderators work on a voluntary basis and receive no perks for their work, other than being able to substitute the word 'chef' into other people's postings when they feel like it.
I can only say that from my own experience of being a Fruit Chat moderator I have NEVER been privy to information that I have not known already and would be able to use to my own advantage and capitalise on that advantage by deletion of a posting.
Once again I reiterate, our processes are transparent and not resistant to probity. We are jovial creatures who will do our best to make your stay enjoyable. We are constantly looking for ways to improve our service and welcome constructive feedback and genuine PMs.
All Fruit Chat clients are reminded that this is a public forum and anything that you read here may not represent the views of the moderatory team. Clients are advised to seek independent legal advice before acting on any advice given in the forums. The moderators accept no liabilty for finanical loss incurred due to following methods insinuated within any posting. The moderators also accept no responsibilty for the word 'chef' appearing numerous times in your posting, mysteriously and overnight.
This posting is an independently produced posting and may not represent the views of anything or anyone or anybody. Anyone sustaining e-paper cuts from this posting is advised to go to sleep. I've had enough of this now. Good tie!
Here at Fruit chat, we strive to provide fruitational excellence and our hardworking team of moderators monitor the board with diligent probity around all hours. Feel the need to speak directly with a moderator? Simply trace your way to The Fruit Chat homepage and look at the users currently online, displayed at the very bottom of the page. Names in green are moderators.
Our moderators are trained to the highest standard of client compliance and will do everything to make your stay as welcoming and entertaining as possible, whilst maintaining professional standards in relation to publicly posted board content.
Currently personal moderator details are only transparent to all board users at the discretion of a particular moderator. These details may be present on the moderators Fruit chat profile. I choose to keep my personal details private.
In answer to some of your interests in moderator details, I shall reveal that I am not in the legal profession. I do not play quiz machines professionally, neither did I capitalise on the recent controversial 'exploits' discussed.
I was invited to be a moderator last year on the recommendation of the current moderatory team at that time. There is an 'admin' or 'big chef' who is the Alan Sugar of Fruitchat, sitting in his board room, ready and waiting to fire any unruly moderators. Fruitchat moderators work on a voluntary basis and receive no perks for their work, other than being able to substitute the word 'chef' into other people's postings when they feel like it.
I can only say that from my own experience of being a Fruit Chat moderator I have NEVER been privy to information that I have not known already and would be able to use to my own advantage and capitalise on that advantage by deletion of a posting.
Once again I reiterate, our processes are transparent and not resistant to probity. We are jovial creatures who will do our best to make your stay enjoyable. We are constantly looking for ways to improve our service and welcome constructive feedback and genuine PMs.
All Fruit Chat clients are reminded that this is a public forum and anything that you read here may not represent the views of the moderatory team. Clients are advised to seek independent legal advice before acting on any advice given in the forums. The moderators accept no liabilty for finanical loss incurred due to following methods insinuated within any posting. The moderators also accept no responsibilty for the word 'chef' appearing numerous times in your posting, mysteriously and overnight.
This posting is an independently produced posting and may not represent the views of anything or anyone or anybody. Anyone sustaining e-paper cuts from this posting is advised to go to sleep. I've had enough of this now. Good tie!
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Matt Vinyl
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7198
- Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 6:56 pm
- Location: Lost in the outback, Bryan
Legendary JG as is par for the course... 
It's spot on though, the Mod 'team' only discuss 'in private' anything to do with potential bannings or site announcements. We're also physically quite 'spread out' around the country (have only met two other mods once, which I must say was a great time!) so if it needs to be fair in that sense, it is...
New moderators are voted upon by the current mod community - based on the need for a new mod (an existing one leaves / relinquishes the responsibililty) and their suitability / availability and general acceptance on the board.
It's spot on though, the Mod 'team' only discuss 'in private' anything to do with potential bannings or site announcements. We're also physically quite 'spread out' around the country (have only met two other mods once, which I must say was a great time!) so if it needs to be fair in that sense, it is...
New moderators are voted upon by the current mod community - based on the need for a new mod (an existing one leaves / relinquishes the responsibililty) and their suitability / availability and general acceptance on the board.
"And do you ever contradict yourself, Minister?" "Well, yes and no..."
Moderators are obviously essential to the success of any forum, and generally I think the Fruitchat mods do a very good job and are a key part of the forum's well-being.
However, on this occasion, I do feel the decision to delete the previous thread has overstepped the mark, and could, as Cool has suggested, give rise to a suspicion that a moderator has, whether intentionally or not, deleted a thread to defend his or a colleague's own financial interests.
I read four or five posts from the deleted thread, and as I recall it consisted of the opening poster offering (by PM), but not stating, a location where a certain game can be found, followed by some very broad questions about that game from Nil Satis and some even broader answers to those questions from another poster. There was nothing that gave away any specific details as to any method for playing the game in question successfully. I don't buy the argument that a thread should be deleted if it gives rise to a risk that a future poster may post something deletable - if that is the case, the offending post should (subject to the points I make in the below paragraph) be deleted then, rather than the whole thread.
Personally, even if someone had posted a method for playing the game in question, I'm not sure I see why that should necessarily be deleted - it seems (going by Lugsy's references to "low post count members" who might know it) to be fairly common knowledge now among the AWP community at all levels, and I'd assume that in reality the remaining sensitive information is the whereabouts of cabinets that still have the game in question on, rather than the nature of the bug.
I can think of plenty of bits of SWP-related information (whereabouts of certain cabinets, names of certain games that offer good rewards but never get discussed on here, that kind of thing) that I'd be a bit annoyed if someone posted on here, but I wouldn't feel entitled to ask a mod to remove. For the record, I've done that only once, when someone made a post that "outed" me against my wishes (not maliciously - the person is someone I've chatted to off the board) and I asked for it to be deleted, which it was. (I take Cool's point re. transparency but see no need to "out" myself in an environment where every other individual but one hides behind a username.)
However, on this occasion, I do feel the decision to delete the previous thread has overstepped the mark, and could, as Cool has suggested, give rise to a suspicion that a moderator has, whether intentionally or not, deleted a thread to defend his or a colleague's own financial interests.
I read four or five posts from the deleted thread, and as I recall it consisted of the opening poster offering (by PM), but not stating, a location where a certain game can be found, followed by some very broad questions about that game from Nil Satis and some even broader answers to those questions from another poster. There was nothing that gave away any specific details as to any method for playing the game in question successfully. I don't buy the argument that a thread should be deleted if it gives rise to a risk that a future poster may post something deletable - if that is the case, the offending post should (subject to the points I make in the below paragraph) be deleted then, rather than the whole thread.
Personally, even if someone had posted a method for playing the game in question, I'm not sure I see why that should necessarily be deleted - it seems (going by Lugsy's references to "low post count members" who might know it) to be fairly common knowledge now among the AWP community at all levels, and I'd assume that in reality the remaining sensitive information is the whereabouts of cabinets that still have the game in question on, rather than the nature of the bug.
I can think of plenty of bits of SWP-related information (whereabouts of certain cabinets, names of certain games that offer good rewards but never get discussed on here, that kind of thing) that I'd be a bit annoyed if someone posted on here, but I wouldn't feel entitled to ask a mod to remove. For the record, I've done that only once, when someone made a post that "outed" me against my wishes (not maliciously - the person is someone I've chatted to off the board) and I asked for it to be deleted, which it was. (I take Cool's point re. transparency but see no need to "out" myself in an environment where every other individual but one hides behind a username.)
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sir ratholer
- Senior Member
- Posts: 1803
- Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:00 am
- Location: Anywhere in the south east
Yeah, totally agree. I've still got many working units with good money in them and I don't want the trick getting further outed. Granted, the operators know about it but some more than others are particularly shoddy about updating software. But my main gripe is that discussion on any relevant method will invoke interest in the 'non pro' community on the machine in question and they may, with some digging, uncover the trick which then could potentially hit my bottom line.Extreme Eddie wrote:I think that any posts referring to current tricks should be deleted, the game in question is no longer in its prime but there are a few still left, i think who ever deleted it was correct to do so, this forum is all about opinions and thats mine.
Maybe some may perceive my comments as a bit selfish but you've gotta look after number one in this game, as we've discussed many times before.
Bored of the grind.
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cp999
- Senior Member
- Posts: 462
- Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:59 pm
- Location: not where I was yesterday
Oh, come on.sir ratholer wrote:Yeah, totally agree. I've still got many working units with good money in them and I don't want the trick getting further outed. Granted, the operators know about it but some more than others are particularly shoddy about updating software. But my main gripe is that discussion on any relevant method will invoke interest in the 'non pro' community on the machine in question and they may, with some digging, uncover the trick which then could potentially hit my bottom line.Extreme Eddie wrote:I think that any posts referring to current tricks should be deleted, the game in question is no longer in its prime but there are a few still left, i think who ever deleted it was correct to do so, this forum is all about opinions and thats mine.
Maybe some may perceive my comments as a bit selfish but you've gotta look after number one in this game, as we've discussed many times before.
Nobody's going to stumble on the method by accident]I don't buy the argument that a thread should be deleted if it gives rise to a risk that a future poster may post something deletable - if that is the case, the offending post should (subject to the points I make in the below paragraph) be deleted then, rather than the whole thread.
[/quote]
Yes, I agree. There would be no posts if that argument was followed strictly.
Just to clarify here, I do know the exact method that is used to all but guarantee a low level win on this game, although I accept that there may be a quicker variant to that method (as was hinted at by the last post I read on that thread before it was deleted). My questions about the original post were genuine and covered:
- the length of time it might take to win the sort of money mentioned - I am genuinely fascinated at the level of work and concentration implied when having to play a single game over and over again
- how players 'know' a cabinet holds X amount of cash. This I suspect is a far murkier area than the time it takes to win, one which may touch on activities that are not strictly above board - I'm not naive enough to believe the 'marked coin' method is the end of the story. Now personally I don't have any wish to get involved in that side of the business but I respect the privacy of those that do - after all you are all grown-ups and have to take responsibility for your actions.
In general then I'd say deleting that thread as it stood (i.e. assuming that nothing else was added) was heavy-handed. I do realise that the issue with this method is that pretty much ANYONE reading this forum could exploit it and hence I can understand why you guys with the patience and dedication to exploit it might want to protect the exact details but then as I said previously the exact details of the method weren't even hinted at on the deleted thread.
I realise I am speaking from something of a privileged position in that I've never had to rely solely on the machines for my income and virtually all the games I have ever made my spare cash on have not relied on tricks, cheats, hidden methods or bugs. Hence I am able to be more open than others perhaps - I remember last year when I mentioned that old Top of the Pops 'free credits' bug just in passing as I assumed it was so obvious it was happening that everyone would have known about it but it seemed that was not the case!
I suppose in the end we have to turn to the wise words of QuizMaster at this point:
NS
P.S. If you are going to delete threads of this nature then the thread where I found that quote will have to go as well...
- the length of time it might take to win the sort of money mentioned - I am genuinely fascinated at the level of work and concentration implied when having to play a single game over and over again
- how players 'know' a cabinet holds X amount of cash. This I suspect is a far murkier area than the time it takes to win, one which may touch on activities that are not strictly above board - I'm not naive enough to believe the 'marked coin' method is the end of the story. Now personally I don't have any wish to get involved in that side of the business but I respect the privacy of those that do - after all you are all grown-ups and have to take responsibility for your actions.
In general then I'd say deleting that thread as it stood (i.e. assuming that nothing else was added) was heavy-handed. I do realise that the issue with this method is that pretty much ANYONE reading this forum could exploit it and hence I can understand why you guys with the patience and dedication to exploit it might want to protect the exact details but then as I said previously the exact details of the method weren't even hinted at on the deleted thread.
I realise I am speaking from something of a privileged position in that I've never had to rely solely on the machines for my income and virtually all the games I have ever made my spare cash on have not relied on tricks, cheats, hidden methods or bugs. Hence I am able to be more open than others perhaps - I remember last year when I mentioned that old Top of the Pops 'free credits' bug just in passing as I assumed it was so obvious it was happening that everyone would have known about it but it seemed that was not the case!
I suppose in the end we have to turn to the wise words of QuizMaster at this point:
All the best,QuizMaster wrote:Bugs and faults come and go, but proper players are forever.
NS
P.S. If you are going to delete threads of this nature then the thread where I found that quote will have to go as well...
Do players not know this sort of thing from the occasional times when it is possible to empty machines through honest endeavour?Nil Satis wrote: - how players 'know' a cabinet holds X amount of cash. This I suspect is a far murkier area than the time it takes to win, one which may touch on activities that are not strictly above board - I'm not naive enough to believe the 'marked coin' method is the end of the story. Now personally I don't have any wish to get involved in that side of the business but I respect the privacy of those that do - after all you are all grown-ups and have to take responsibility for your actions.
For example, it is known (or at least received wisdom) than an ItBox hopper now only holds about £50, because people were emptying them for those sorts of amounts when they got big wins on Jiggy Bank back in the day? Likewise, at least back at the time of Jiggy Banks, GamesNets held at least £80. The £120 chimes with what Brewis reckoned after his Big Match World Cup escapades. Presumably, some of our AWP chums can tell us what a Paragon hopper holds given their recent exploits.
Of course, what a hopper holds is not the same as what it actually does hold - a pro may just have visited the machine and taken a good tranche out, but I guess if you find something in the middle of nowhere, your working assumption might be a full hopper.
Without going into too much detail (mainly because I don't understand much of that detail ) the experienced AWP boys seem to have several 'tricks of the trade' that tell them how much money a machine holds, and indeed how much has gone into a machine since a certain date, in a much more reliable way than simply guessing based on past experience.
You can always of course use what I am now going to name the 'Calvin & Hobbes' approach * - keep taking small amounts until the machine stops paying - but there do seem to be more scientific methods out there should you wish to use them.
* When on a long car journey he asks his Dad how they determine the load limit for bridges, his Dad replies that they drive progressively heavier and heavier trucks over the bridge until it breaks. Then they weigh the last truck and rebuild the bridge.
) the experienced AWP boys seem to have several 'tricks of the trade' that tell them how much money a machine holds, and indeed how much has gone into a machine since a certain date, in a much more reliable way than simply guessing based on past experience.You can always of course use what I am now going to name the 'Calvin & Hobbes' approach * - keep taking small amounts until the machine stops paying - but there do seem to be more scientific methods out there should you wish to use them.
* When on a long car journey he asks his Dad how they determine the load limit for bridges, his Dad replies that they drive progressively heavier and heavier trucks over the bridge until it breaks. Then they weigh the last truck and rebuild the bridge.
I'm sure there's several ways to work out how much is in the units, Personally I use a dirty coin follwed by a shiny new one to tell. But you don't know whats in it until they come back out. Other ways are using the notey when it disables to judge what it's got but even they can be set to £30/£50 & £70 cut offs on paragons.
betchrider wrote:You go upto a bird and grab her quim and say "im gonna knock the fuck outta this" and see what happens
I wouldn't call you selfish, being a pro gambler you need to be. But in this instance I'd say Paranoid would be a good word to use. The internet has been a big problem yes, but the problem is when that 1st person puts up a thread "Such n such a machine" Hows everyone doing???sir ratholer wrote:
Maybe some may perceive my comments as a bit selfish but you've gotta look after number one in this game, as we've discussed many times before.
That is what starts people talking and sparks peoples interests in something they wouldn't normally bother with, And that's the problem that needs deleting right from the off.
Not a genuine thread several months down the line about something that has been widely spoken about over many threads yet crucially the main part has never been posted.
Fair enoigh people still have workers, I have 1 myself but I doubt the thread that got deleted would have resulted in half of stoke-on-trent going on a major pub crawl looking for the fecker.
betchrider wrote:You go upto a bird and grab her quim and say "im gonna knock the fuck outta this" and see what happens
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sir ratholer
- Senior Member
- Posts: 1803
- Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:00 am
- Location: Anywhere in the south east
To vaguely answer, it doesn't take very long and you don't need to use the 'below board' method to avoid totally emptying most cabinets - some you do but as I won't use a key, I'll roughly try and work out how much each of those units should hold on a given day and take that amount out, means I leave some in it sometimes but that's not necessarily a bad thing as having looked after my sites I still have plentyNil Satis wrote:Just to clarify here, I do know the exact method that is used to all but guarantee a low level win on this game, although I accept that there may be a quicker variant to that method (as was hinted at by the last post I read on that thread before it was deleted). My questions about the original post were genuine and covered:
- the length of time it might take to win the sort of money mentioned - I am genuinely fascinated at the level of work and concentration implied when having to play a single game over and over again
- how players 'know' a cabinet holds X amount of cash. This I suspect is a far murkier area than the time it takes to win, one which may touch on activities that are not strictly above board - I'm not naive enough to believe the 'marked coin' method is the end of the story. Now personally I don't have any wish to get involved in that side of the business but I respect the privacy of those that do - after all you are all grown-ups and have to take responsibility for your actions.
In general then I'd say deleting that thread as it stood (i.e. assuming that nothing else was added) was heavy-handed. I do realise that the issue with this method is that pretty much ANYONE reading this forum could exploit it and hence I can understand why you guys with the patience and dedication to exploit it might want to protect the exact details but then as I said previously the exact details of the method weren't even hinted at on the deleted thread.
I realise I am speaking from something of a privileged position in that I've never had to rely solely on the machines for my income and virtually all the games I have ever made my spare cash on have not relied on tricks, cheats, hidden methods or bugs. Hence I am able to be more open than others perhaps - I remember last year when I mentioned that old Top of the Pops 'free credits' bug just in passing as I assumed it was so obvious it was happening that everyone would have known about it but it seemed that was not the case!
I suppose in the end we have to turn to the wise words of QuizMaster at this point:
All the best,QuizMaster wrote:Bugs and faults come and go, but proper players are forever.
NS
P.S. If you are going to delete threads of this nature then the thread where I found that quote will have to go as well...
Bored of the grind.
To answer a few things...
Dunno who deleted the thread in question, but it wasn't me. I didn't even see it. I know what it's on about though. The difference with most of the SWP guys here is that they win with their noggin so their method of winning is totally unaffected by anything else other than brainpower. This and other things of this ilk however can be picked up by any old muggins off the street if it's plastered all over, why do they deserve to know? Keep it shtum.
At a rough estimate i'd say you can rack up an easy £50 bank in half an hour. Childs play really if you have just a modicum of general knowledge and common sense. You can tell balances on different cabs with marked coinage, a bog standard L&F, or just a quick coin fire on a whirring empty cab. Not difficult really.
Dunno who deleted the thread in question, but it wasn't me. I didn't even see it. I know what it's on about though. The difference with most of the SWP guys here is that they win with their noggin so their method of winning is totally unaffected by anything else other than brainpower. This and other things of this ilk however can be picked up by any old muggins off the street if it's plastered all over, why do they deserve to know? Keep it shtum.
At a rough estimate i'd say you can rack up an easy £50 bank in half an hour. Childs play really if you have just a modicum of general knowledge and common sense. You can tell balances on different cabs with marked coinage, a bog standard L&F, or just a quick coin fire on a whirring empty cab. Not difficult really.
"Sixty percent of the time, it works, every time!"
Matt B, I totally agree with. The scams seem to be operated by the fruit machiners. Do they find out because (a) us the quizzers are so intellectually arrogant we cant believe that somebody knows something we dont. (b) fruity players co-operate more.(c) there are more of them (d) they have more insider (company) info from moles (e) they think more laterally.
coincidentally I visited a pub today with a games warehouse.The landlord and his deputy were watching me intently,then after finishing they explained why.2 guys who were well known fruity players a few months ago suddenly switched to the gw and proceeded to empty it .Apparently the scam involved switching the quizzer off and on like a christmas tree ,this would reset a certain game(since deleted and they didnt reveal it to me cash stakka?) to easy mode and out would come another jackpot.Eventually the machine said iou£20 and they were given their marching orders.They told me what we thought , the bit at the bottom referring to lost winnings was introduced as a result of the scams although they penalise everybody. No I didnt get barred and I'm welcome back anytime-----I talk to publicans about what I do---the minority are anti the majority can see that Im honest(and some would say foolish) so that it clears the air.
coincidentally I visited a pub today with a games warehouse.The landlord and his deputy were watching me intently,then after finishing they explained why.2 guys who were well known fruity players a few months ago suddenly switched to the gw and proceeded to empty it .Apparently the scam involved switching the quizzer off and on like a christmas tree ,this would reset a certain game(since deleted and they didnt reveal it to me cash stakka?) to easy mode and out would come another jackpot.Eventually the machine said iou£20 and they were given their marching orders.They told me what we thought , the bit at the bottom referring to lost winnings was introduced as a result of the scams although they penalise everybody. No I didnt get barred and I'm welcome back anytime-----I talk to publicans about what I do---the minority are anti the majority can see that Im honest(and some would say foolish) so that it clears the air.