Fruit Machine Chat

cool wrote:If the machine income from swp's is in decline why are (1) there are more makers of games than ever (2) All the big pub companies have them in their pubs (3) The manufacturers/ suppliers of the machines are constantly trying to improve the look /content of the machine (4) many more pubs have two swp's in them

As someone who has seen virtually all the machines since Give Us a Break and has played all over the country on and off for 20 years (albeit never as my only form of income), I thought I'd add my two penn'orth to cool's interesting post.

I could well believe that machine income overall is in decline but would equally agree with cool's points. However the two views aren't incompatible if you look at it like this:

(1) More makers of games than ever - possibly related to the expansion generally in the IT sector and the much wider availability of programming skills in the population. How many people would have had the interest or expertise to create quiz games 20 or even 10 years ago? We would all I'm sure agree also that increased QUANTITY rarely if ever relates to increased QUALITY - better 5 good games than 50 crap ones!

(2) All the big pub companies have them - true I guess, but this has been the case for several years really

(3) The improvements in look and content - they are trying to do this agreed but is this a desperate attempt to chase an ever decreasing pot, and to draw in people who otherwise wouldn't play the machines? Again, I'd also make the point that I'd always prefer to play a clunky, visually dull game that offered decent prizes than some beautifully designed piece of art that only ever offered £1 and that for 15+ minutes' work

(4) More pubs with two SWPs - possibly true but again this could also be due to each individual machine earning less than previously and hence pub companies feeling the need to take up more valuable space to keep at least some income rolling in.

A lot of this is based on guesswork of course and I'm not saying I know the answers any more than cool or anyone else.

As for the future? Well, to be honest I've never really understood why pubs ever have SWPs if they are just there to make money. Fruit machines have always seemed to me the most incredibly lucrative form of gambling (for the owners, not the punters!) - what casino or bookies wouldn't give their right arm for 30% guaranteed take?? Obviously the quiz machines aren't there to LOSE money for pubs but for me they have always been partly about providing something sociable that will encourage people to (a) come in at all and (b) stay drinking for longer.

However I've found the last year or so incredibly depressing, not just for players like ourselves but also for the prospects of ordinary punters continuing to play the machines in great numbers. The quality of so many new games has been so poor that it does make me wonder how long there will be decent SWPs worth playing at all. I realise punters and players want different things but when the one thing that punters want (a reasonable length of game with an occasional win of £3 to £5 to make the challenge worthwhile) is being gradually removed from each new game that comes out, I do wonder what the future holds.

There you are - that's what getting knocked out of the FA Cup does to you...

I see no real future for them to be honest. Especially not in the regular money making department. I think it'll just gradually decline to more sociable play than anything else.

Why not spend your time playing the AWPs and live off them like i do :P

The trouble is, I really enjoy playing SWPs after thumping the AWPs. I enjoy a nice cold pint with a mate or two playing DOND / Bully / WWTBA-Pounder-aire.

Plus, what's the betting I'll finally finish programming a game and all boxes will be binned from pubs...

It would be a shame if they're removed as they provide another angle of 'interest' in a pub. Even if 'winning' is not always the main objective (although for 90% of people I'd assume it is!) it's a good laugh, especially when there's five or six of you and you've all had a few beers and want to beat Chris 'Suet-face' Tarrant at least once!

I seem to recall that when quiz machines first came out pubs were not allowed to have as many AWPs as now. The jackpots were very low and they were hampered with tokens. So the quiz machine then did represent significant extra revenue. And they were a bit of a craze for a few years and generated good profits for the operators.

SWPs were in serious decline though by the early 90s and were really only given a new lease of life by the Monopoly SWP. And then in the late 90s the same thing happened and they were revived again with WWTBAM and then the arrival of multi-game terminals. The economics of multi-gamers are much more favourable to the operators than old single game hardware. So I think if anything these saved the future of the SWP (or at least pseudo-skill games) for the foreseeable future anyway.

It will be interesting to see the consequences of the smoking ban. The government is likely to give some sweetners to licenced trade to ease their problems. One of these is likely to be allowing much larger AWP jackpots in pubs.

I would like to expand a little on the Nil Statis post regards the lack of good SWP's. I believe that we are seeing here the result of game developement companies not spending the money in producing games as they only go to terminals and there income can't make up the difference of profit from a new machine. We have lost the new dedicated machines. WTTBAM was fantastic along with PocketMoney new machines great games. Now I can't remember when I saw the last new machine in a pub. You see some in arcades, shooting games from Namco or Sega as such but nothing for the pub.
I like Golden Tee golf for enjoyment with friends and now seem to spend more time playing this game than SWP's.
Some of the SWP games are totally dreadful IMHO.

from the atei floorplan it appears that LL/revolution/itbox are not exhibiting this year (i might be wrong but i can't see any of those three names on the list) gwhl are there as are fat spanner and gamesmedia but no sign of the shitbox stable.

this leads me to one of four conclusions:

a. they have been bought out
b. they are exhibiting but with a different name (do they not realise that pseudonymity is crass?)
c. they have thrown in the towel
d. they are exhibiting and i should have gone to specsavers

Leisure Link/ITBox are owned by Inspired Gaming Group who are on stand 530

you are quite right. i didn't know that.