FOBT's

harry2 · Post by **harry2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:16 am

What you wish for !!!

Betting shops could be allowed to install unlimited numbers of fixed odds gaming machines under controversial plans to liberalise gambling laws.

MPs will today demand an end to the four per shop limit, saying gambling has become a ‘legitimate entertainment activity’.

Dubbed the crack cocaine of the high street, the terminals let customers bet up to £100 and win £500. Campaigners say they fuel problem gambling because the stakes are so high.
The Commons culture, media and sport select committee is seeking an overhaul of ‘outdated’ gambling laws.

Following an inquiry, they say decisions on the location of casinos and the number of fixed odds terminals allowed in betting shops should be set by councils, rather than by ‘central diktat’.
John Whittingdale, Tory chairman of the committee, said: ‘Gambling is now widely accepted in the UK as a legitimate entertainment activity.
‘We took a lot of evidence in this inquiry, from all sides, and while we recognise the need to be aware of the harm caused by problem gambling, we believe that there is considerable scope to reduce and simplify the current burden of regulation and to devolve decision-making to a more local level
'Widely accepted': John Whittingdale said gambling is now viewed as a 'legitimate entertainment activity'
‘The “reluctantly permissive” tone of gambling legislation over the last 50 years now looks outdated.’
One source close to the committee described the most recent Gambling Act of 2005 as ‘puritanical’.

But opponents of the shake-up condemned the push for more betting machines, which would see the limit in casinos raised from four to 20.
The MPs said allowing high street bookmakers to use more than four machines would prevent the problem of ‘clustering’ where several firms locate closely together.
But critics said their solution would just lead to many more opportunities for gamblers to lose money.

One addict ‘banned’ himself from every betting shop in East Anglia after he lost £100,000 in four years on the terminals.
Gareth Wallace, the Salvation Army’s public affairs adviser, who gave evidence to MPs, said: ‘This is a one-way bet towards more addictive gambling machines in our communities.
‘Betting shops are making more and more profit from virtual games, away from real horses. We are perplexed that the committee would recommend a further liberalisation of gambling machines when they have heard evidence that problem gambling is on the rise.
‘If the committee gets its way, betting shops will be subject to no compulsory limit on these machines and, for the first time, gaming arcades will be allowed to operate them.’
The Local Government Association welcomed greater powers for councils but denounced the plans to permit an explosion in the number of terminals.
Clyde Loakes, of the LGA’s environment and housing board, said: ‘While it is an important step that the CMS Committee has recognised that the clustering of betting shops is a concern for local people, their response to the problem is completely illogical.

‘It’s clearly not sensible to increase the number of slot machines in betting shops to tackle the problem of too many slot machines.’
The gambling industry welcomed the report however.
Malcolm Moss, chairman of the National Casino Industry Forum, said: ‘We are very pleased the committee has recognised the value, integrity and achievements of the British casino industry.
‘We are pleased that the committee has identified the failings of the 2005 Act in creating a twin-track industry which puts British businesses at a disadvantage and costs jobs and investment.

'Harmonising the rules on the number and type of gambling products all casinos can have will prevent customer confusion and make it clear what to expect from a UK casino.’
The MPs called for lower taxes on betting firms to encourage them to move their operations back to the UK. This, they claimed, would allow for better regulation of the gambling industry.
The MPs have also asked the Department of Culture to conduct more research on problem gambling among children, and help find ways of teaching young people about the dangers of betting.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -laws.html

feeder22 · Post by **feeder22** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:58 am

harry2 wrote:and while we recognise the need to be aware of the harm caused by problem gambling

I'd say their aware for sure that 99% of people you see playing these terminals are problem gamblers. They know this they just dont give a shit.

Bringing them into arcades. Wow an even faster way for people to lose money.

If I was PM for just a few minutes i'd ban 'random' machines outright from the amusment arcades & betting shops. Only compensated aloud. At least then a person could eventualy get that high prize/s they sat at the machine in the first place for.

harry2 · Post by **harry2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:21 pm

Reading's got Two Ladbrokes, Two Paddy Powers, Three Corals and a William Hill's and is much smaller than Coventry. Two sets of shops on opposite sides of the road.

It's all right putting a few gamcare leaflets out, but I have NEVER had an approach from a member of staff asking about problem gambling.

ps Seven months without a spin on the devil's wheel and counting

Oscar · Post by **Oscar** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:36 pm

Weston Super Mare has 6 betting shops in the centre, all within a couple of minutes walk of each other. It's disgusting, but the Government care firstly for themselves so it looks like they are here to stay.

Well done on 7 months without a spin, i've managed just over 2 weeks but this time i'm more determined because i'm costing myself money, not what I lose but more the money i'm missing out on because I can't sustain a float. I got used to being skint most of the time, so it's nice to see some money building back up for a change.

maverick69 · Post by **maverick69** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:53 pm

Oscar wrote:Weston Super Mare has 6 betting shops in the centre, all within a couple of minutes walk of each other. It's disgusting, but the Government care firstly for themselves so it looks like they are here to stay.

Well done on 7 months without a spin, i've managed just over 2 weeks but this time i'm more determined because i'm costing myself money, not what I lose but more the money i'm missing out on because I can't sustain a float. I got used to being skint most of the time, so it's nice to see some money building back up for a change.

People should have some self control and not go in, cant blame everyone else all the time

Oscar · Post by **Oscar** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:34 pm

Where does it say I blame anyone for my gambling losses?

The answer, nowhere.

Think before you post Maverick, you silly little boy.

maverick69 · Post by **maverick69** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:45 pm

Oscar wrote:Where does it say I blame anyone for my gambling losses?

The answer, nowhere.

Think before you post Maverick, you silly little boy.

im not talking about you specifically, im talking about in general

Cf · Post by Cf » Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:49 pm

Gambling as an entertainment...

I walked into some services t'other night. Around the walls were pictures of lots of happy smiling faces (attractive women mostly) putting money into the machines and obviously having the time of their lives.

Then I glanced around at the dank room I was in where someone was getting visibly upset on a £500.

As for FOBTs, well... bookies should be there to take bets. If there's not a market for that then they should close. Random slots and casino games should be in regulated casinos. I'm not entirely sure why we're looking to protect shops whose purpose it is to take your money for nothing in return.

Captain.Tattybojangles · Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:11 pm

One word

Tax

anonamouse · Post by **anonamouse** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:08 pm

off the web;

This turbo-charged gambling is a niche occupation – fewer than 1 in 20 adults has used a fixed-odds betting terminal in the past year. But within this tiny group, they are phenomenally popular: based on financial statements from the biggest bookmakers’ accounts, the Bureau estimates that £123m a day is wagered on the UK’s 32,000 terminals. The bookmakers keep a tiny proportion of this, but it still adds up to £3.3m a day, or £1.2bn a year, according to the Gambling Commission.

Ironically, the gaming machines make bookmakers less dependent on chance: whereas a surprise sports result can affect a whole financial quarter, with fixed-odds betting terminals the returns are just that – fixed. The company keeps a long-term average of around 3% of the money staked on them.

For bookmakers it’s a winning strategy. The machines contributed 49% of William Hill’s high-street gains from bets last year – £424m. And each year bookmakers squeeze out more profits. William Hill’s latest figures show its 9,000 fixed-odds betting terminals earned an average of £900 a week – more than double the £402 per machine it earned in 2005.

£900 a week average per box, £3,600 per shop....

another site says...

"They offer games such as bingo and roulette to customers who don’t need to talk to a soul to play. With a maximum spin of £100 and the ability to press ‘repeat bet’ every 20 seconds, it’s not surprising that Ladbrokes took £10.5 billion from them last year alone."

"random", but not random enough that the bookie has any chance of losing.

oldskool · Post by **oldskool** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:48 pm

One addict ‘banned’ himself from every betting shop in East Anglia after he lost £100,000 in four years on the terminals.

And we all know he could of done £100,000 in a month quite easilly.
More of these fotbs mean more tax revenues for the gov't, but at the cost of more problem gamblers and many people's lives being ruined.

i haven't gambled a penny since march and can honestly say i do not miss it. i fell asleep on my train last saturday and had to spend £30 quid on a taxi. i felt sick about it, yet 6 months ago if i went into a bookies and went on the fobt for more than 10 minutes and walked away 'only' losing £50 i would feel as if i had 'won' ..... bizzarre!

Simo7 · Post by **Simo7** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:00 am

Written evidence submitted to parliment by Fairer Gambling Campaign (GA 56)
"Roulette in casinos had a retention rate of under 15% in 2009/2010. Credible estimates of the retention rate on Fixed Odds Betting Terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops (where virtually all turnover is on roulette) are as high as 75%. It is therefore clear that roulette on FOBTs is not as fair as roulette in casinos. The betting shop industry has not been willing to publish this retention rate."

The "hold" retention rate on FOBTS is huge Id say thats down to them being highly addictive and people doing there nuts on them day in day out rather than them being fixed in anyway. but hey guess were getting Ladbrokes arcades/casinos Roll up Roll up!

Cf · Post by Cf » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:14 am

Yeah, higher retention rate doesn't necessarily relate to being rigged. The different setting and clientel will be a big factor.

Noels Beard · Post by **Noels Beard** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:33 am

I've often considered the implication of the non cash payout as well. Of course, there are many reasons why they are ticket only: but when you see the amount of low stake play they receive, can you see many people cashing a ticket for £7.20?

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:18 am

Simo7 is your avatar rows of pound coins with a few coppers and silver at the front?